In honor of World Mental Health Day, Jamie to sits down with Dr. Grant Blashki, the clinical medical lead at Beyond Blue, to discuss mental health issues that impact the veterinary profession. Vets do amazing work each day to keep our animals healthy, but they also face heavy burdens – and even the most resilient people need support sometimes. For years, Zoetis has partnered with Beyond Blue to support mental health challenges faced by people living in rural Australia. Tune in to learn about the impact of Beyond Blue’s work and how we can continue supporting each other’s wellbeing.
Jaime:
Hello, I'm Jaime Brannan, President Zoetis International Operations. And I'd like to welcome you to the third episode of season two of my podcast Wellness. In this podcast, I'm connecting with Zoetis colleagues, the greater veterinary and animal health community, and other experts about topics around wellbeing. From understanding the positive impact pets can have on our physical and mental wellbeing to learning how we can better manage stress at work and find a comfortable life balance. We're continuing the conversation about how we can better look after ourselves and support each other.
Jaime:
Today I'm excited to sit down with Dr. Grant Blashki, the Lead Clinical Advisor for Beyond Blue, an Australian mental health and wellbeing organization. Zoetis has partnered with Beyond Blue to support veterinarian's and farmer's mental wellness since 2016. Dr. Blashki has an amazing background supporting mental health. In addition to his role with Beyond Blue, he's also a practicing GP and a university lecturer at several institutions.
Jaime:
His three key themes of research include mental health, environmental health, and global health. So he brings a broad perspective on healthcare support across the spectrum. Dr. Blashki, I'm excited to talk to you today about supporting mental health, especially as it relates to veterinarians and farmers. Would you like to introduce yourself and your work to our listeners?
Grant:
Yeah. Hi Jaime, it's just great to be on your podcast and we really appreciate all the support of Zoetis and the partnership with Beyond Blue. It's just fantastic. As you said, I do work as a clinical GP and I'm the lead clinical advisor for Beyond Blue. I really enjoy working with them. We're the most visited mental health organization in Australia. And our chair is former prime minister, Julia Gillard. We get about 18 million contacts a year. There's only about 25 million Australians, so we are part of the fabric here. And for all the wrong reasons, we've actually been pretty active the last couple of years because of the pandemic. Been pretty bumpy time for people, pretty tough. So delighted to chat with you about farmers and vets and all the great work Zoetis is doing
Jaime:
So it was through our team in Australia and the close partnership you guys have that I learned a lot more about Beyond Blue. And also the challenges that we see people are facing, particularly living in rural areas, the support service is an amazing offering. It's potentially providing life-changing or life-saving services, especially for those feeling really isolated, which can often include our customers, may they be veterinarians or farmers.
Jaime:
You mentioned the couple of years we've just had with the COVID-19 pandemic, but the devastating effects of isolation can come through a number of ways and reasons. And when we think of the droughts, the bushfires, serious flooding on top of the pandemic, this is going to cause a lot of upset and stress to people. And perhaps people living in cities might not understand some of the stresses that are seen in rural communities. It'd be great if you could share with us some of the pressures that you've seen in rural areas and those which have affected veterinarians and farmers and what they can do to help cope with these.
Grant:
In Australia, we've got a very significant rural and remote population. It's 28% of the population and then 45% of our population live in the big cities of Sydney and Melbourne. And the first thing I want to say is there's lots of positive aspects to living rural remote life. And some of the studies show higher life satisfaction, whether that's because you're in connection with nature or strong community. And probably the rates of mental health issues, by and large, are pretty similar actually to the cities. I guess the tricky bit, the downsides, there are less services, especially in a country like Australia, that so spread out. We're a massive land mass. So it is harder to get to see someone if you run into trouble. And we do have significantly higher suicide rates in rural, especially remote areas. And so we take this pretty seriously, because Beyond Blue's brief is around depression and anxiety, but also working really hard to try and reduce the case where someone chooses to take their own life. Pretty serious outcome with all this reverberations through the community.
Grant:
So it's complex why such things should happen. But we do know that the pandemic really was a bit of a triple whammy in Australia. And for many of your listeners all around the world, it was so disruptive on family life and relationships. There were the financial stresses and job uncertainty. And then also just the sheer worry about COVID and different views about vaccines and things. So it sort of took society and gave it a big shake up.
Grant:
People in the city don't always understand that our farmers, they've often got to be super-people who are juggling multiple roles. So yes, they've got the production roles, but they've also got to be experts in HR often, and be tech experts to understand what's going on with international markets, and then they're running a business. So there's a lot going on for modern farmers. And we overlay that in Australia with a pretty rugged couple of years with droughts and bushfires and flooding.
Grant:
It sounds a bit biblical. The last couple of years, we feel like the 10 plagues have arrived, but we do know that our farmers are about half as likely, actually, to go and visit their GP or a mental health professional. Just a comment about our vets who are the other big group listening, I was interested when I was working up to chat to you today and I was looking at the vet Association's website in Australia ,and mental health was really prominent on it. So I was surprised to see when I had a look at the vet website in Australia, just how common mental health issues were and how prominent it was for the vet association. And some 70% of vets had said they'd lost a friend or a colleague to suicide, which was just heartbreaking to think about that. And so I think with Zoetis getting on the front foot and saying, "Okay, we're prioritizing mental health." It's a great contribution to these groups of people. And it helps to raise the prominence of the issues.
Jaime:
Which is hugely important, awareness. Being able to actually have that conversation, be able to say, "I'm not okay." And like you say, instead of just that can-do spirit. And it was interesting what you said about the role of a farmer now in terms of the production role, the HR management, the tech expert, the business person, that's very similar for a vet now. Perhaps in days gone by where it was fully just a clinical role, but these people are business owners and they have all these challenges and things to think about. And I wonder how much with the shake up we've seen in the last couple of years, as you say, with the pandemic and with everything that's been thrown at Australia, as you say, whether it's the drought, whether it's the floods, whether it's the bushfires, it's been kind of a perfect storm.
Jaime:
And I wonder, as you think about the vet and that ingrained love for animals, but it could also make their job really difficult. They've really emotionally invested in the pet. They can thrive and enjoy life when the pet's healthy, but they also carry some of the burden if the pet's unwell. And at times they have to deliver really difficult news. And we are really committed at Zoetis to ensure that we bring these issues among the veterinary community. And your work is critical to this. And I'd love to hear some of your thoughts on how to spot signs of depression. Maybe it could be a colleague, it could be a friend or family, could be a customer, but when someone is mentally unwell, what are the signs? How can people help?
Grant:
Just a couple of points there. I mean one thing in the pandemic is we had a big surge of pet ownership, and in parts of Australia we had very significant lockdowns. And I think the figures were that dog ownership went up from 61 to 69%, over two years. So it was hard to buy a dog at a certain point. They were a sought after purchase. So there's that element. The other thing you just touch on, there's a lot of pressure from the customers. Of course, we want to be providing a great service, but people are so emotionally connected to their pet and they have a lot of demands on the vets and dare I say, not all the customers are easygoing either. So they are having quite a lot of pressure in that regard. But what do you do if you're worried about a friend or a colleague in this setting?
Grant:
So I always say, let's be careful not to over medicalize normal human emotions. It's great that we're talking about it, but sadness is not always depression and being worried, appropriately worried, maybe your business is under huge pressure. That's not an anxiety condition, that's just being a human being being worried. So there's that context that all of us have our ups and downs, but there are some things that you can look for to think, "Oh, this is something more serious."
Grant:
And the way I differentiate it is you look at how long things have been going on. If someone's mood's really been off for more than two or three weeks, you start thinking, "Gosh, this is not a little bump. Maybe we're heading towards a mental health condition." You look at behaviors. So drop in work performance. Someone who's been high-functioning, suddenly they're not coming in, they're not doing their job properly, something's changed. Getting into conflicts, quite common, particularly people who are quite confident usually, it may not be that their mood is depressed, that they may uncharacteristically just been getting into a lot of arguments at home or at work and being quite difficult. Withdrawal. So not answering calls, not wanting to go out. Drug and alcohol use very common. A lot of people, they're feeling awful and they'll start drinking a bit more. And sleep disturbance is another common thing we see. People be up half the night, watching Netflix or not getting enough sleep.
Grant:
A lot of people are somewhat daunted by how would I raise this with a friend or a colleague? And you don't want to intrude either. So you've got to use common sense. But a couple of good tips, pick a good time when there's no one else around. Maybe even when you're doing something else. So you might be going for a drive or a walk or fixing something on the farm or in the vet service. So you're sort of busy rather than you're necessarily in their face. And you'll say something like, "Oh, I've noticed that you missed three days last week." Or, "You seem exhausted. I've noticed that. How's things going? How are you?" And just leave it at that. And it depends, as we said, a lot of people in the farming and vet industry are self-reliant and they'll go, "Oh, no, I'm pretty good. Everything's fine." Or in classic Australian lexicon, they go, "Oh yeah, she's right, mate."
Grant:
But it doesn't matter. You've sort of raised it and they might come back to it or they may tell you their story and they go, "Oh, thanks for asking. It's been awful since my relationship broke up. I'm actually not doing so good at the moment." And if that happens, couple of things to remember, you don't have to be a psychologist, You don't have to solve it. Try and just sit on your hands and not jump in. In the anxiety of it all, it's very tempting to go, "Oh yeah, what happened to me..." And you go into your own story. So just try and sit back and listen.
Grant:
And then a good thing to say is, "How do you think I could help you? What would work for you?" And often people will tell you, it might not be what you thought. If you're a boss at work, they might say, "Look, the early morning, open up, killing me at the moment. Can I get someone else to do those for a minute?" Or find out what might help, or if it's serious, "Maybe we should book you in with the local doctor." In Australia, anyway, we have a system where our GP's are quite a big part of our mental health workforce. So you go to the local doctor and they do this thing called a mental health plan. And that entitles you to government subsidized sessions with psychologists.
Grant:
But I'm sure there are multiple different systems around the country and around the world, in your listeners, ways you access. But the point is link them in with the services that are there. And don't forget, as well, that you really might save someone's life. It might seem like a tiny thing, but there's a lot of very isolated people out there. And you might just be that bridge that gets them into services that make all the difference.
Jaime:
I'm a big believer if this conversation can help one person, it's been a great conversation. And there's some great advice there in terms of don't make it an event, try and make it a normal conversation within something that's going on normally, but in a quiet environment. Make sure you're listening, but don't be an expert. We want to be there to support. So try and get these people to some support rather than actually trying to solve the issue. There's experts, like your good self, that can support people with the care they need, but just being able to get someone to have that conversation, I think, is so important.
Grant:
Yeah, I think the other thing to say is there's a lot of things that workplaces can do that can create a very conducive environment to keeping your workforce mentally healthy. And we've really seen modern management, at the moment, has really got serious about mental health. And it makes a lot of sense, right? It makes sense from a human compassion point of view, we want our colleagues to feel good about their lives and working well in the organization, but it also makes business sense.
Grant:
So one of the big accounting firms with Beyond Blue some years ago, PricewaterhouseCoopers did a study and they found for every dollar that organizations are putting into making the workplace a mentally healthy workplace, they ultimately get back $2.30. So it's really in everyone's interests. And there's lots of good things that organizations can do to make a mentally healthy workplace. Of course, with all these things, leadership's crucial. The culture gets set from the top and leaders can really raise the issue of mental health by openness, sharing some vulnerability.
Grant:
And the other thing which may not seem immediately obvious is actually good governance and good job descriptions. And clarity of roles is one of the best things you can do for people. I see a lot of young people, as a doctor, who are stressed out by their job. And if there's ambiguity about what they're supposed to do, or they don't have the tools or the capacity to do it, that is a great way to upset someone's mental health.
Grant:
And then one other thing is zero tolerance for bullying and discrimination. And I think that the management and the team saying, "No, no, that's not on." And on day-to-day level, just not participating in the gossip or the rubbish that can go on in organizations, leaning in, being your best self can be great for a mentally healthy organization.
Jaime:
Yeah. I mean, there's some great advice there and we take it incredibly serious. And leading with empathy is really important to us at Zoetis. I think as we are coming back from the pandemic, as we're living in more flexible work/life balances, flexible working conditions, I think that's going to be great to support people's wellbeing and perhaps just their schedules with kids and with the dogs at home and everything else. But I think we've also just got to keep that watch out to make sure that we can keep people connected and so that we can have these conversations and that ambiguity in role. I think it's a really, really strong point because I think if you're really not quite sure what the objectives are, especially perhaps in younger people, that can be quite tough. And if you are then working remote, you can't just have the quick conversation with the person next to you. So I think the level of connection as we have different ways of working, moving forward, is going to be incredibly important.
Grant:
One of the common issues is getting this boundary between work and life. And I think that's very relevant for farmers and vets because those lines aren't always as clear as they were, the role. And so I think being quite explicit about when you're on and when you're off is really important.
Jaime:
I shared in an earlier podcast about me personally, during the pandemic, completely lost control of my own day. Completely lost it and reframing that was probably the first step for me in my wellness plan, because if I framed the day, I knew when I was working, I knew when I was with the family, when I could exercise, when I could walk the dog, which was also really important during the pandemic. And giving yourself that structure and time when you're working from home, I think is hugely important, hugely important.
Grant:
The other joker in the pack is sleep and we know that not getting enough sleep is really a good way to set off your mental health issues. Particularly with the hyper connected world we're in, it's bottomless. And so institute a few things there. So plug in your phone maybe outside of your room overnight, so you're not peeking at it overnight. Maybe set a tech off time. For me, it's 11:00 PM, whatever else I'm doing. I'm like, "Okay, that's enough. Before I fall into the abyss of YouTube algorithm driven, 3:00 in the morning." Which is all too easy to do.
Grant:
And the other thing I'd say is with this fairly challenging period we've all been through is curate who you follow and what you're watching. I often talk about the hope budget. What I mean by that is all those things we talked about, the pandemic, the climate change and droughts and fires, you can start feeling like the world's going to hell in a hand basket, which it's not. And particularly if that is sort of driven by a steady flow of negative social media and news, that'll make you feel awful. So don't follow it, put it away. Personally, I get all the social media off my phone and just keep it on an iPad at home, so it's not constant. Come up with your own strategy, but I wouldn't leave all that hyper connectedness, that digital stuff to chance. Sit down and go, what works for me? What do I really need on my phone? And what am I going to just have a little look at when I get home?
Jaime:
Yeah, the doom scrolling, they call it on social media with everything that's going on in the world. At the moment, you can read bad news, 24 hours a day and limit it. And I'm with you a hundred percent on the sleep, give yourself an end of day and stick to it, which is not always easy, but that end of day and start of day, I think is really important. Grant, this has been great. I've really enjoyed the conversation, but I'm also really conscious of your time. And I think you've got to get to practice, right?
Grant:
Yeah, that's right. Back to the real world as a clinical GP. It keeps me honest, but yeah. Love chatting to you, as well, and chatting to your listeners. And Beyond Blue is very appreciative of the partnership with Zoetis, really value it. And that money that's been raised, I think it's something like $600,000 in the last six years is extraordinary. And that has actually supported 12,500 Australians accessing mental health support through Beyond Blue. We have a phone line and a website and a peer support forum and all sorts of services. So it contributes to something very tangible, very important for us in Australia.
Jaime:
Well, we're really honored to support where we can. And for everything you and the organization is doing, we're there to support and we look forward to continuing the partnership over many, many years in the future. And in partnership, continuing to help raise awareness of mental health and wellbeing.
Grant:
Fantastic. Good to chat. Have a great day.
Jaime:
I found the conversation with Dr. Grant. Blashki very powerful today. It's important to courageously address topics around suicide prevention and nurturing mental health, even if these conversations can be difficult. Thanks, Dr. Blashki, for sharing your experiences and expertise with me today. If you want to learn more about the important work Beyond Blue is doing in Australia, visit beyondblue.org.au. Thanks for tuning in and until next time, stay healthy, safe and be well.